Cornish Steve Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 3 minutes ago, Hafnia said: I read Hayley's story Steve yes. Not calling her a man in the same way I wouldn't call a transitioned person their former gender. So stop looking for offence - not biting. If she never had androgen insensitivity she would be masculine. Chromosomes define your biological gender - end of story. A Y chromosome indicates male. Go take your argument up with professors Apologies that I edited my post while you were responding, so our messages crossed. I'd value your thoughts on the final statement, though. Before the age of genetics, there would have been absolutely no issue, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 15 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said: Apologies that I edited my post while you were responding, so our messages crossed. I'd value your thoughts on the final statement, though. Before the age of genetics, there would have been absolutely no issue, right? There was issues though. Foekje Dillemma, fortunately women's boxing is a late addition to the games and getting punched in the head with extra power shouldn't be a risk..... but IOC said "hold my beer" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 Something something pointless culture war arguing something something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 2 minutes ago, StatesideToffee14 said: Something something pointless culture war arguing something something. What?! pointless? A sports governing body putting athletes at risk pointless? ok..... we will just stick to the likes of the premier league being a laughing stock then eh? or maybe not... call them all out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 Personally, I feel there's a lot more at play here than meets the eye. Whether it will all come out is a different matter but I do think there are politics involved in this whole thing when you look into things a bit. I do think she's a woman but I feel very fucking uncomfortable debating the private medical history of another person, so I'm just not going to get involved in it any more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 17 minutes ago, Hafnia said: What?! pointless? A sports governing body putting athletes at risk pointless? ok..... we will just stick to the likes of the premier league being a laughing stock then eh? or maybe not... call them all out. Who was the one who started this whole discussion talking about virtue signalers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 11 minutes ago, Romey 1878 said: I do think she's a woman but I feel very fucking uncomfortable debating the private medical history of another person, so I'm just not going to get involved in it any more. This is exactly where I'm at as well. The reaction to this whole story has been beyond stupid. It's weird and creepy for some people (speaking in general here) to act like they have to personally see what is inside a person's pants to confirm whether they're a man or woman. Since apparently it's tough for some to imagine that only men and not women can do something incredible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 10 minutes ago, StatesideToffee14 said: Who was the one who started this whole discussion talking about virtue signalers? I'm not virtue signalling. Far from it.... I think you will find the virtue signallers coming out with nonsense saying that females with male chromosomes should be able to punch women in the head cis it's unfair not make them feel like a woman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 50 minutes ago, Hafnia said: I'm not virtue signalling. Far from it.... I think you will find the virtue signallers coming out with nonsense saying that females with male chromosomes should be able to punch women in the head cis it's unfair not make them feel like a woman. Freudian slip? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 56 minutes ago, Hafnia said: I'm not virtue signalling. Far from it.... I think you will find the virtue signallers coming out with nonsense saying that females with male chromosomes should be able to punch women in the head cis it's unfair not make them feel like a woman. That's the nature of boxing. How many fighters have died as a result of a strong punch in the ring? Personally, I've never understood the attraction of such a sport in the first place given its inherent danger, but I realize I'm in a minority on that one. What about fox hunting or bull fighting, or is it only human life for which we have concern? The point you raise, though, is valid. Until recent years, we've mostly pretended that those with intersex characteristics were freaks to be ignored or swept under the carpet, no matter how unfair to them. We did this in the past with the physically disabled, but now there are laws to accommodate their needs, and there are the Paralympic Games. This is wonderful. How do we recognize the human worth of those whose gender does not fall into traditional definitions? It's not an easy question to answer. Should they be excluded from all sports? What about shooting or archery? No need. What about running? Should we do away with the male/female divide in sports altogether? Intelligent and compassionate people ought to be able to find a solution that works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 Julien Alfred from Saint Lucia wins gold medal in the women's 100 meter dash. It is the first Olympic medal of any kind for the small Caribbean nation. Cornish Steve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 15 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said: Intelligent and compassionate people ought to be able to find a solution that works. This won't happen while one of side of the discussion is making bad faith arguments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 15 minutes ago, StatesideToffee14 said: Julien Alfred from Saint Lucia wins gold medal in the women's 100 meter dash. It is the first Olympic medal of any kind for the small Caribbean nation. Julien? Surely it's a man pretending to be a woman!! dunlopp9987 and MikeO 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted August 3 Report Share Posted August 3 2 hours ago, StatesideToffee14 said: This won't happen while one of side of the discussion is making bad faith arguments. Whats the bad faith argument? you wanna see a fighter killed before getting this issue sorted??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted August 3 Author Report Share Posted August 3 1 hour ago, Hafnia said: Whats the bad faith argument? you wanna see a fighter killed before getting this issue sorted??? Right there. "An individual might make a bad faith argument to undermine their opponent’s position or otherwise “win” a debate. Undermining an opponent might mean pushing them to defend an unrealistic, inaccurate version of their position in an attempt to derail a discussion, change the discussion’s topic, or bait the opponent into an argument." You're implying anyone who disagrees with you would be happy to see someone die, thus giving yourself a morally superior position....and nobody wants to a see a fatality obviously...bad faith arument https://www.grammarly.com/blog/bad-faith-good-faith/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 3 hours ago, Hafnia said: Whats the bad faith argument? you wanna see a fighter killed before getting this issue sorted??? I saw Apollo Creed get killed in the ring by Ivan Drago. Does that count? Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 Saw this and it made me think of a few posters on here: Matt, Formby and MikeO 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 5 hours ago, Cornish Steve said: Julien? Surely it's a man pretending to be a woman!! We should put Hafnia in charge of making sure she's a woman then I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 2 hours ago, MikeO said: Right there. "An individual might make a bad faith argument to undermine their opponent’s position or otherwise “win” a debate. Undermining an opponent might mean pushing them to defend an unrealistic, inaccurate version of their position in an attempt to derail a discussion, change the discussion’s topic, or bait the opponent into an argument." You're implying anyone who disagrees with you would be happy to see someone die, thus giving yourself a morally superior position....and nobody wants to a see a fatality obviously...bad faith arument https://www.grammarly.com/blog/bad-faith-good-faith/ Unrealistic??? hardly unrealistic. Let's use Connor benn as an example.... clearly was juicing - two samples found levels of clomifene. Look at his fights pre and post being caught. Absolutely night and day difference. Chris Eubank was livid and rightly so - he was involved in a fight that seen Michael Watson end up almost dead and severely handicapped. Connor benns dad himself had a fight that seen Gerald McLennan in a similar state. to argue the enhanced testosterone levels in a boxer isn't putting opponents at risk of death is far from unrealistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 3 minutes ago, StatesideToffee14 said: We should put Hafnia in charge of making sure she's a woman then I guess. I'd use your estrogen levels as a bench mark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 3 minutes ago, Hafnia said: I'd use your estrogen levels as a bench mark. How is going ad hominem helping your case? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 1 hour ago, StatesideToffee14 said: How is going ad hominem helping your case? Rather than passive aggressive? Fine - I suppose that's the difference between testosterone and estrogen. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 9 hours ago, Hafnia said: Rather than passive aggressive? Fine - I suppose that's the difference between testosterone and estrogen. This is why TT is such a great place. We can have intense and emotional disagreements, but no grudges are held and, in a typical British way, humour can break any tension. Thanks for the latest example. MikeO, Matt and Hafnia 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoo 2.0 Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 56 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said: This is why TT is such a great place. We can have intense and emotional disagreements, but no grudges are held and, in a typical British way, humour can break any tension. Thanks for the latest example. I hate you all equally. Cornish Steve, Matt, dunlopp9987 and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 9 minutes ago, Zoo 2.0 said: I hate you all equally. I knew @Romey 1878had a second account! dunlopp9987, Romey 1878 and Zoo 2.0 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 19 minutes ago, Zoo 2.0 said: I hate you all equally. 10 minutes ago, Matt said: I knew @Romey 1878had a second account! I was just going to agree with him but you had to go low. I'll go high and just tell you to fuck off and have a nice day. Matt and dunlopp9987 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 3 hours ago, Cornish Steve said: This is why TT is such a great place. We can have intense and emotional disagreements, but no grudges are held and, in a typical British way, humour can break any tension. Thanks for the latest example. Must admit I actually chuckled at my own joke. Matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 3 hours ago, Romey 1878 said: I'll go high and just tell you to fuck off and have a nice day. I think that's what Hafnia was trying to say to me but he was being passive aggressive about it. Romey 1878 and Matt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StatesideToffee14 Posted August 4 Report Share Posted August 4 Novak Djokovic wins gold medal match in men's singles tennis in straight sets over Carlos Alcaraz. Gold medal was the only accomplishment that had eluded him in his legendary career. Scottie Scheffler shoots a course record 62 and wins gold in the men's golf tournament. It's been quite the golf season for Scheffler as he has won 6 tournaments on the PGA Tour this year, including the Masters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted August 4 Author Report Share Posted August 4 49 minutes ago, StatesideToffee14 said: Scottie Scheffler shoots a course record 62 and wins gold in the men's golf tournament. It's been quite the golf season for Scheffler as he has won 6 tournaments on the PGA Tour this year, including the Masters. Beat an Evertonian into second place, fuck off yourself Romey 1878 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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