Jaden Philogene

[Hafnia]

9 minutes ago, SpartyBlue said:

You’re speculating on all of that.  Let’s assume it’s true though and you know exactly what we are asking for and exactly what they’ve offered. It’s a negotiation. Maybe we can reach an agreement and maybe not. Maybe they simply are not willing to pay 80m. Maybe we will accept significantly less. You don’t know. 
 

Regardless this is not an unusual scenario. You don’t think we come in low when trying to reach an agreement on a player? Supporters generally want their club to be tough negotiators when buying and selling so why the pushback when other clubs are the same? That hypocrisy is what I’m pointing out. The obvious explanation is everyone wants to get the absolute best deal for their club no matter what it is. *shrugs.

You are missing the word realistic....

would man United go and offer that sort of bid to Chelsea / Arsenal etc for a young talent valued at £80m? Of course they wouldn't - it's disrespectful and I hope it bites them on the arse. 
 

any club is able to benchmark branthwaite - he's our most important player... he's better than most if not all defenders in the league, he's left footed, quick, dominant in the air.....  if they started the bidding at £50m it wouldn't sit as bad, to go £35 to £40m is a piss take 

 

[Btay]

I think it’s more the dealings in the past that have left a sour taste amongst some of our fans with United. Theres almost an expectation amongst united that when they come calling for one of our players we should graciously accept.

After their first “offer” they would have known where we sat with our valuation, to make another offer so far off our valuation is a pisstake. I would love us to slap another 10m on top just to show we aren’t push overs.

[SpartyBlue]

1 hour ago, Hafnia said:

You are missing the word realistic....

would man United go and offer that sort of bid to Chelsea / Arsenal etc for a young talent valued at £80m? Of course they wouldn't - it's disrespectful and I hope it bites them on the arse. 
 

any club is able to benchmark branthwaite - he's our most important player... he's better than most if not all defenders in the league, he's left footed, quick, dominant in the air.....  if they started the bidding at £50m it wouldn't sit as bad, to go £35 to £40m is a piss take 

 

“Valued at”. This isn’t  some appraisal. It’s just whatever number a club feels like throwing out there. Do you know 80m is our number? Do you know what we hold ultimately take? No to both. 
 

This is business between two clubs. If you get your feelings hurt because of an opening offer then you shouldn’t be anywhere near a negotiation.  Jarrad has performed very well but he also has very little experience in the league.  To start calling him the best defender in the league is premature. 
 

Either the clubs will reach an agreement or they won’t but you shouldn’t take this so personal because we will be on both ends of similar situations many many times in the future. Imagine we got emotional every time we fell lowballed and told another club to go to hell. Pretty soon we’d have really limited our options in future buying and selling and hurt the club.  Maybe it’s best to be professional. 

[Hafnia]

7 hours ago, SpartyBlue said:

“Valued at”. This isn’t  some appraisal. It’s just whatever number a club feels like throwing out there. Do you know 80m is our number? Do you know what we hold ultimately take? No to both. 
 

This is business between two clubs. If you get your feelings hurt because of an opening offer then you shouldn’t be anywhere near a negotiation.  Jarrad has performed very well but he also has very little experience in the league.  To start calling him the best defender in the league is premature. 
 

Either the clubs will reach an agreement or they won’t but you shouldn’t take this so personal because we will be on both ends of similar situations many many times in the future. Imagine we got emotional every time we fell lowballed and told another club to go to hell. Pretty soon we’d have really limited our options in future buying and selling and hurt the club.  Maybe it’s best to be professional. 

Its been widely reported as that figure because the paid the region of that for maguire.  Its is also the figure that is paid for top end centre halves.

i personally wouldn't sell him for £80m because you know what..... that season that you seem to think doesn't make him experienced showed us his minimum level which gives greater stats than other centre halves in the league.

cant be arsed justifying it - you clearly haven't watched enough of him to know what the rest of us seem to know.

You've been told that United have history of acting like this with us - accept that many of us are emotive about this for good reason.  Got loads of United fans who watch the epl from all round the world saying £50m is too much..... I expect that they haven't watched him much - pretty much the same as you. 
 

one of the few Everton players who I believe you need to see in the flesh to appreciate how good he is. Not being a "I go the game" person cos I go very infrequently - but he is the player who is in that criteria.  

[Harv]

From the paper gossip this morning, Tractor Boy’s are favourites to sign him.

[Romey 1878]

13 minutes ago, Harv said:

From the paper gossip this morning, Tractor Boy’s are favourites to sign him.

Think Jarrad can do better than them but it is a step up from United like.

[RuffRob]

My issue with Utd on the Jarrad front is - he is a player we don't want to really sell this season. So if somebody really really wants to get us to sell this season, then your going to have to pay top top money for him. He's not transfer listed or surplus to our requirements. We have made this perfectly clear.

Utd originally tried to pull a fast one prior to 30th June to get him on the cheap and it didn't work, but they seemed to be some bellyaching about that from Utd the camp with media report that Utd saying we are being 'unreasonable' with the price!! and then allegidly complaining to the PL about our and other clubs transfer dealings to get around PSR, so not having to sell our best player at knockdown prices. It wasn't the buyers market than some maybe thought it would be, so relatively slim picking for the vultures in the end.

Radcliffe is coming accross a cheeky fucker, from implying that tax payer should help fund a new stadium for Utd (as it will the Wembley of the north), to saying the big 6 should have more power in the PL, cos they are the main attraction.

It not about them simply putting in a cheeky offer, it seems to me the a Radcliffe's Utd seem to think they have some sort of god give right over clubs given they are bigger name in the PL. 'We're the main attraction, we should have all the best players, we should be making the rules...". 

I have spoke to a few Utd fans they have all have said they are finding Radcliffe attitude a bit embarressing.

[RuffRob]

back to Philogene - I am not 100% sure if this transfer saga is over yet. 

Hard to know if todays stories are simply slow jurno/blogggers catching up with yesterdays news. 

Sounds to be like Ipswich have upper their offer to maybe £18m from the original £16m, becasue we have equalled their £16m to try and nick the player from under their noses. I can't blame Hull for saying we'll be taking the higher £18M offer. I would expect us to be taking the best offer for any player who is leaving?

Also read that Philogene prefers Ipswich's offer - be it more money or simply a guarrenteed starting slot in the first 11. He put in a transfer request at Villa last year becasue he wanted to be playing and not sat on a bench, even at the expense of going down a league - so far do's to him for wanting to play, and playing has paid off for him to showcase his talent.

 

[Romey 1878]

 

[RuffRob]

1 minute ago, Romey 1878 said:

 

definatley is becoming a saga!!!

As long as we are not doing our old trick - of putting all our efforts in to a ultimately fruitless chase for a players transfer.

We are probably not in the position to do so at the moment, but sometimes if you really really want certain player (to fit the system you have etc) in this position you just need to put in a bid that puts rival bids off. Not saying Philogene is that type of player. Just a general comment on getting deals done for players you really want.  

 

 

[Romey 1878]

1 hour ago, RuffRob said:

definatley is becoming a saga!!!

As long as we are not doing our old trick - of putting all our efforts in to a ultimately fruitless chase for a players transfer.

We are probably not in the position to do so at the moment, but sometimes if you really really want certain player (to fit the system you have etc) in this position you just need to put in a bid that puts rival bids off. Not saying Philogene is that type of player. Just a general comment on getting deals done for players you really want.  

 

 

Genuinely believe he's not even at the top of our list for winger signings tbh.

[Romey 1878]

It sounds like he will be re-signing for Villa.

Who knows, they may be re-signing to sell him on for more because with their sell-on clause they're only paying around £13.5m for him if they get him.

[StevO]

1 hour ago, Romey 1878 said:

It sounds like he will be re-signing for Villa.

Who knows, they may be re-signing to sell him on for more because with their sell-on clause they're only paying around £13.5m for him if they get him.

Nice. We sign him from Villa for £16m, transfer friends arent we?

 

[SpartyBlue]

10 hours ago, Hafnia said:

Its been widely reported as that figure because the paid the region of that for maguire.  Its is also the figure that is paid for top end centre halves.

i personally wouldn't sell him for £80m because you know what..... that season that you seem to think doesn't make him experienced showed us his minimum level which gives greater stats than other centre halves in the league.

cant be arsed justifying it - you clearly haven't watched enough of him to know what the rest of us seem to know.

You've been told that United have history of acting like this with us - accept that many of us are emotive about this for good reason.  Got loads of United fans who watch the epl from all round the world saying £50m is too much..... I expect that they haven't watched him much - pretty much the same as you. 
 

one of the few Everton players who I believe you need to see in the flesh to appreciate how good he is. Not being a "I go the game" person cos I go very infrequently - but he is the player who is in that criteria.  

Why is it people only trust media reports when it agrees with whatever their preconceptions are and all other times it nonsense? Who at Everton has said this is our number or that we even have a number? Who at United? It’s all just speculation unless you have an actual source for this information. 
 

I’m well aware of Branthwaite. In the states we would call him a blue-chip prospect. You seem to think I’m arguing something that I am not. I agree he’s a tremendous young talent. That’s not what this is about though. In order to command world class money you generally need a longer resume than he has, particularly when you’re in defense. He does not yet have the resume where the perception is that he’s a world class defender. Which is why the best offer we’ve heard for him has been roughly 50m from one club. Maybe more offers are coming but at a certain point a player is worth what other clubs will pay and he’s just not there yet seemingly.

He’s worth a tremendous amount to Everton. I think his presence makes any relegation battle very unlikely and I expect he will be worth even more next summer. For those reasons I think we would require an offer that may not come. This conversation is just about perception. 1 great premier league season from a defender isn’t likely to make you an 80m+ player in the eyes of buyers, that’s all.

[duncanmckenzieismagic]

2 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

It sounds like he will be re-signing for Villa.

Who knows, they may be re-signing to sell him on for more because with their sell-on clause they're only paying around £13.5m for him if they get him.

So Lewis Dobbin back on loan then?

[Hafnia]

3 hours ago, SpartyBlue said:

Why is it people only trust media reports when it agrees with whatever their preconceptions are and all other times it nonsense? Who at Everton has said this is our number or that we even have a number? Who at United? It’s all just speculation unless you have an actual source for this information. 
 

I’m well aware of Branthwaite. In the states we would call him a blue-chip prospect. You seem to think I’m arguing something that I am not. I agree he’s a tremendous young talent. That’s not what this is about though. In order to command world class money you generally need a longer resume than he has, particularly when you’re in defense. He does not yet have the resume where the perception is that he’s a world class defender. Which is why the best offer we’ve heard for him has been roughly 50m from one club. Maybe more offers are coming but at a certain point a player is worth what other clubs will pay and he’s just not there yet seemingly.

He’s worth a tremendous amount to Everton. I think his presence makes any relegation battle very unlikely and I expect he will be worth even more next summer. For those reasons I think we would require an offer that may not come. This conversation is just about perception. 1 great premier league season from a defender isn’t likely to make you an 80m+ player in the eyes of buyers, that’s all.

They Seem to be making an awful lot of noise about a player only worth £30m..... just for context they quoted us £30m Marcus Rojo - you know the dead wood centre half who couldn't get a game. 

[Shukes]

Reality is guys, we’re not likely to buy anyone else without another sale.

[Matt]

11 hours ago, Shukes said:

Reality is guys, we’re not likely to buy anyone else without another sale.

I'm amazed we got this far with the sales we made. Onana and, unfortunately, DCL it seems nets us quite a bit in theory. Just hope the talks about DCL are only because he's collaborating with us. If no sensible offers come in I think he happily signs a new deal, but that's very much wishful thinking because I think we're really going to miss him.

[RuffRob]

11 hours ago, Shukes said:

Reality is guys, we’re not likely to buy anyone else without another sale.

I simply don't think we can go full tilt in the transfer market until the new ownership is signed, sealed and delivered. I know owners can't plough money in like they used to. However, give that buy out could be with equity or debt, or a mix of both, then this does have an impact on our annual finances give that interest on debt make a massive difference on net outgoings. I would guess new owners would also have knowledge on likley commercial deals, stadium naming right etc that could possibley impact this years accounts. I am sure Dyche and Thelwell will have quite a narrow band width to work with until new owners are officially in the door. 

sales will also have significant impact on release of additional funds for recruitment. 

 

[Wall Writer]

13 hours ago, Shukes said:

Reality is guys, we’re not likely to buy anyone else without another sale.

Maybe it’s me , but it does also seem a little like we are being more sensible and deliberate with signings. Not throwing stupid fees and wages at unscouted players.
Whether that us being forced to due to financial constraints or deliberate planning or a bit of both it’s certainly a more sustainable approach 

[Romey 1878]

He’s gone out to Turkey for preseason training with Hull, so it doesn’t appear that anything is imminent. 

[Shukes]

7 hours ago, Romey 1878 said:

He’s gone out to Turkey for preseason training with Hull, so it doesn’t appear that anything is imminent. 

Great news.

If we buy him he will have really white teeth!

[Romey 1878]

3 hours ago, Shukes said:

Great news.

If we buy him he will have really white teeth!

I hope he doesn't spoil it by going the same place Cenk did for his hair.

[Romey 1878]

 

[RuffRob]

Strange given he put in a transfer request last year because he wanted first team football. Not sure he's a starter in their current team. I surpose CL had to be a bit of a draw. Guess his sale last summer helped Villa current PSR position, even if he's now cost Villa £8.5m more than they sold him for. 

 What a strange financial world football is now.

[Romey 1878]

2 minutes ago, RuffRob said:

Strange given he put in a transfer request last year because he wanted first team football. Not sure he's a starter in their current team. I surpose CL had to be a bit of a draw. Guess his sale last summer helped Villa current PSR position, even if he's now cost Villa £8.5m more than they sold him for. 

 What a strange financial world football is now.

They'll probably sell him on again next summer and help out with PSR again.

[Romey 1878]

Signed for Villa.

[Gwlad]

Villa seem to have a big open cheque book.