Sean Dyche

[Cornish Steve]

Let's get real for a moment.

1) We have a small squad, for obvious financial reasons, and therefore suffer more than most when injuries hit key players.

2) Our defence was one of the best in the league last season. When Branthwaite returns and O'Brien gets accustomed to this league, it will once again be very strong. Plus, Dyche knows how to fix a leaking defence.

3) Our weakness for some time has been scoring goals, and you can see the difference Ndiaye and others will make. Add a fit Broja and Chermiti, and goals will soon come in abundance.

4) We have six new players, most of whom will be starters. It takes time to blend a team when half of the players are new to the squad.

5) Hindsight is always 20-20. Managers make what they believe to be the best decisions at the time. Sometimes, it doesn't work out - regardless of the manager. Even the world's top managers get it wrong at times.

I have complete confidence that by mid-season we're going to be rocking. Based on most of yesterdays' game, we're also going to be an exciting team to watch. Our new players will transform this team, thanks to an excellent recruitment window. Let's just have a little patience and stop making knee-jerk reactions.

[DownUnderToff]

22 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said:

O'Brien gets accustomed to this league, it will once again be very strong.

How is he going to get accustomed without playing?  Was 2-0 up, at home, not an opportune time to perhaps blood him?

[patto]

38 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said:

Let's get real for a moment.

1) We have a small squad, for obvious financial reasons, and therefore suffer more than most when injuries hit key players.

2) Our defence was one of the best in the league last season. When Branthwaite returns and O'Brien gets accustomed to this league, it will once again be very strong. Plus, Dyche knows how to fix a leaking defence.

3) Our weakness for some time has been scoring goals, and you can see the difference Ndiaye and others will make. Add a fit Broja and Chermiti, and goals will soon come in abundance.

4) We have six new players, most of whom will be starters. It takes time to blend a team when half of the players are new to the squad.

5) Hindsight is always 20-20. Managers make what they believe to be the best decisions at the time. Sometimes, it doesn't work out - regardless of the manager. Even the world's top managers get it wrong at times.

I have complete confidence that by mid-season we're going to be rocking. Based on most of yesterdays' game, we're also going to be an exciting team to watch. Our new players will transform this team, thanks to an excellent recruitment window. Let's just have a little patience and stop making knee-jerk reactions.

Knee-jerk played 3 lost 3 

[Cornish Steve]

20 minutes ago, patto said:

Knee-jerk played 3 lost 3 

Yes, knee-jerk. We're missing key players and adding several new players to the starting line-up. Let's see how things look in October and November, shall we?

[RuffRob]

.Dyche got things wrong in the opening game by not starting Ndiaye and got things wrong in this game by not making the correct substitutions to see the game out. 

4-6 points lost in opening two home games. These are decisions he ultimately becomes accountable for. 

I am not blinkered either way with Dyche, but if you keep losing games that you should have won then the outcome eventually become inevitable. 

[Hafnia]

5 hours ago, dunlopp9987 said:

Feel like you said that multiple times last season...

If we actually had a board he would have been gone by march. Tell me I'm wrong? 
 

the fact he is still here is down to a freak week and now it seems normal service has resumed. 
 

his stock is the lowest it's been since he's been here "that's the reality" in his words. 

[Hafnia]

1 hour ago, RuffRob said:

.Dyche got things wrong in the opening game by not starting Ndiaye and got things wrong in this game by not making the correct substitutions to see the game out. 

4-6 points lost in opening two home games. These are decisions he ultimately becomes accountable for. 

I am not blinkered either way with Dyche, but if you keep losing games that you should have won then the outcome eventually become inevitable. 

Just a bit of a stubborn divvy isn't he.

lost a fair few points cos of ndiaye - quite clear from pre season that the lad has more quality on the ball than any other player at the club and yet Saturday was his first start.... 

[Matt Tiger]

3 hours ago, RuffRob said:

.Dyche got things wrong in the opening game by not starting Ndiaye and got things wrong in this game by not making the correct substitutions to see the game out. 

4-6 points lost in opening two home games. These are decisions he ultimately becomes accountable for. 

I am not blinkered either way with Dyche, but if you keep losing games that you should have won then the outcome eventually become inevitable. 

This is the only game we should’ve won in my opinion. Brighton is a more talented team than us. 

[RuffRob]

10 hours ago, Matt Tiger said:

This is the only game we should’ve won in my opinion. Brighton is a more talented team than us. 

sorry, but Brighton game was there for the winning. Pretty much all of us would have had Ndiaye starting that game.

I am not 'Dyche out advocate', but he got himself a red mark off me for the Brighton game. 

two winnable games at home and two defeats, and Dyche has to own these from what are managers decisions. He had to get a least a point from that game by leaving most the new players out. Ndiaye should have started, not doing so mad a massive difference to the feel of opening day. Football is an emotional game, should have help feed the passion of a full stadium on the opennong day. 

I defended him last year when we got 'unlucky' with suckered punches in games etc.

but I will call out poor results from particularly poor decisions  - he doesn't get my support unconditionally. He has put himself on a sticky wicket now. 

[Hafnia]

watching toffeetv.... fans absolutely livid, the lads who present absolutely fuming. 
 

he's won 5 games in 2024..... 

baz shed more light on the Patterson slap and it ties in with what @patto said.  It was bad,  players getting dragged off due to the inappropriate nature of it all. 
 

ndiaye by all accounts was getting console ex by medical team and O'Brien cos he was gutted to come off and to lose. 

[Cornish Steve]

3 hours ago, Hafnia said:

watching toffeetv.... fans absolutely livid, the lads who present absolutely fuming. 
 

he's won 5 games in 2024..... 

baz shed more light on the Patterson slap and it ties in with what @patto said.  It was bad,  players getting dragged off due to the inappropriate nature of it all. 
 

ndiaye by all accounts was getting console ex by medical team and O'Brien cos he was gutted to come off and to lose. 

So what are you suggesting? We keep players on for longer than they can cope, risking unnecessary injury? Of course players will be disappointed, and I'd be frustrated if they weren't, but the guy just made his first start after upping his fitness levels. Frankly, I'd be furious if Dyche kept him on the field and then he was ruled out for a month.

[RuffRob]

16 minutes ago, Cornish Steve said:

So what are you suggesting? We keep players on for longer than they can cope, risking unnecessary injury? Of course players will be disappointed, and I'd be frustrated if they weren't, but the guy just made his first start after upping his fitness levels. Frankly, I'd be furious if Dyche kept him on the field and then he was ruled out for a month.

but he did this with Timi and Coleman and it ultimately cost us the game. We can use 5 subs the same as Bournmouth could have. So we ran out of steam as a team for the last 10-15mins, but only used two out of five subs allowed and both these subs where very late in the game.

Coleman was a player coming back from injury (and is senior in years) and Bournmouth brought fresh legs against him. Why was he still on the pitch - with two other (three if you include Garner) options to replace him sitting on the bench. 

[Gwlad]

Ndiaye only had 7 minutes more of normal time left. They had not planned for his game, then on comes Mr Playable Doucoure. Accident waiting to happen.

[Cornish Steve]

7 minutes ago, RuffRob said:

but he did this with Timi and Coleman and it ultimately cost us the game. We can use 5 subs the same as Bournmouth could have. So we ran out of steam as a team for the last 10-15mins, but only used two out of five subs allowed and both these subs where very late in the game.

Coleman was a player coming back from injury (and is senior in years) and Bournmouth brought fresh legs against him. Why was he still on the pitch - with two other (three if you include Garner) options to replace him sitting on the bench. 

...after saying all week that we have no-one available to play right back!

It's so easy to suggest what should have been done after the fact, but we have a small and depleted squad at various levels of fitness and experience playing with the team. Sure, things could have been done differently, and we could have played someone out of position at right back and still lost the game.

Let's not forget that we completely outplayed Bournemouth, so we have good things to look forward to. Frankly, we should just move on.

[Hafnia]

2 hours ago, Cornish Steve said:

So what are you suggesting? We keep players on for longer than they can cope, risking unnecessary injury? Of course players will be disappointed, and I'd be frustrated if they weren't, but the guy just made his first start after upping his fitness levels. Frankly, I'd be furious if Dyche kept him on the field and then he was ruled out for a month.

Did you watch the game?

do you want me to stack rank the players who's legs had gone cos it looks like this:-

Tim

coleman

Gana

mcneil

Ndiaye 

DCL

so.... if 2 of the centre midfielders who had covered at least 11km each were dead on their feet by 75 minutes - why did he bring off ndiaye to put a player who was more tired in his place (McNeil) 

 

please explain to me how he left the defensive/box to box midfielders to stay on the pitch when they were gassed to bring on a player who literally does nothing in midfield?   
 

why did he take off the only player up front who can look after the ball?  I see some people trying to defend him but I'm sorry - it was absolutely mind boggling how he made those decisions. 
 

I'll tell you what he does - he has pre determined subs. Without question. 

[Hafnia]

2 hours ago, Cornish Steve said:

...after saying all week that we have no-one available to play right back!

It's so easy to suggest what should have been done after the fact, but we have a small and depleted squad at various levels of fitness and experience playing with the team. Sure, things could have been done differently, and we could have played someone out of position at right back and still lost the game.

Let's not forget that we completely outplayed Bournemouth, so we have good things to look forward to. Frankly, we should just move on.

so Ashley young, Roman Dixon and James Garner were on the bench for no reason other than to watch?  Nonsense. Could have brought them on for Coleman. Young for last 15 and garner for Tim 

[Shukes]

At least Dom’s fortunes have turned around this week haha

[patto]

17 hours ago, Hafnia said:

watching toffeetv.... fans absolutely livid, the lads who present absolutely fuming. 
 

he's won 5 games in 2024..... 

baz shed more light on the Patterson slap and it ties in with what @patto said.  It was bad,  players getting dragged off due to the inappropriate nature of it all. 
 

ndiaye by all accounts was getting console ex by medical team and O'Brien cos he was gutted to come off and to lose. 

I can’t find this which episode is this on. 

[Hafnia]

19 minutes ago, patto said:

I can’t find this which episode is this on. 

Yesterday's 1pm broadcast.  Baz deffo has inside contacts at the club. He worked there for years. 

A few of us said at the time - playful "joke" slap my arse... the fallout said everything about it. 

a comment came on screen and basically said dyche lost the dressing room after that and it was the players getting together that kept us up.  Baz confirmed that he knew it was a bad incident - with people getting dragged off etc. 

 

 

[patto]

6 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

Yesterday's 1pm broadcast.  Baz deffo has inside contacts at the club. He worked there for years. 

A few of us said at the time - playful "joke" slap my arse... the fallout said everything about it. 

a comment came on screen and basically said dyche lost the dressing room after that and it was the players getting together that kept us up.  Baz confirmed that he knew it was a bad incident - with people getting dragged off etc. 

 

 

Sound I’ll try and find it

[patto]

34 minutes ago, patto said:

Sound I’ll try and find it

I found it Baz says exactly what I said people on here saying it was trivial and a playful tap let’s be honest the players on that trip won’t forget what happened there’s no I in team and that’s what Dyche is he’s all me me me.  
he’s just a bully and nothing else if we weren’t in such a mess he would already be gone it was a sackable offence. 

[Palfy]

16 hours ago, RuffRob said:

but he did this with Timi and Coleman and it ultimately cost us the game. We can use 5 subs the same as Bournmouth could have. So we ran out of steam as a team for the last 10-15mins, but only used two out of five subs allowed and both these subs where very late in the game.

Coleman was a player coming back from injury (and is senior in years) and Bournmouth brought fresh legs against him. Why was he still on the pitch - with two other (three if you include Garner) options to replace him sitting on the bench. 

Bournemouth did use 5 subs not could have. 
Our problem is Dyche not the players, we bring in 4 out field players and for the first game only play one ,and on the 2nd game start one and use one as a sub, Ndiaye has proven not starting him from the off was a huge mistake I would say from what we’ve seen he was 100% ready for the Spurs and Brighton games, would we have won those games with him starting probably not, but I don’t think we would have been so humiliated as we were. 
You could give Dyche the world and he would still manage to fuck it up, renound for setting teams up to defend, well it would appear that that has now deserted him, so there’s not much left for him to offer as a manager, he needs to be shown the door in the next few days. 

[Hafnia]

3 hours ago, patto said:

I found it Baz says exactly what I said people on here saying it was trivial and a playful tap let’s be honest the players on that trip won’t forget what happened there’s no I in team and that’s what Dyche is he’s all me me me.  
he’s just a bully and nothing else if we weren’t in such a mess he would already be gone it was a sackable offence. 

I said at the time - a slap to the back of the head is one of the most demeaning/crude displays of power things you can do in front of people. 
 

the question no one wanted to answer was "would dyche have done it to a senior player or one who had more standing in the team?"

absolutely not. 

 

[Hafnia]

 

[Matt]

So you're Ped?

Edit: so now the manager is 100% to blame and the professionals who collapsed like a souffle are absolutely exempt of blame. I was a bit early on my initial reaction apparently but here we are. 

[Matt]

To be fair to Ped, he presents himself well even if I don't agree with him on all of it. But he also said a couple of interesting things:

1) fingers need pointing back at the owner, he's only sticking around to see if he can salvage his money. He's the root cause and I wish the owner would get a healthy amount of the vitriol Dyche gets.

2) If Dyche thinks just staying up is good enough then he isn't good enough. Completely agree but if Dyche doesn't want to win things he wouldn't be in the role he's in. So if it's not intent, then it's incompetence which has more weight as time goes by. 

But, and this is my biggest irritation, it's still 10 professional footballers (can't bring Pickford into this) who, having kicked the ball off after 2-1, couldn't keep it for a few minutes at home. 3 goals in 10 minutes in any game is unacceptable but with 3 mins to go? They just switched off and that for me is worse than poor substitutions. They're both bad, I'm just annoyed it's always one or the other.

[Hafnia]

14 minutes ago, Matt said:

To be fair to Ped, he presents himself well even if I don't agree with him on all of it. But he also said a couple of interesting things:

1) fingers need pointing back at the owner, he's only sticking around to see if he can salvage his money. He's the root cause and I wish the owner would get a healthy amount of the vitriol Dyche gets.

2) If Dyche thinks just staying up is good enough then he isn't good enough. Completely agree but if Dyche doesn't want to win things he wouldn't be in the role he's in. So if it's not intent, then it's incompetence which has more weight as time goes by. 

But, and this is my biggest irritation, it's still 10 professional footballers (can't bring Pickford into this) who, having kicked the ball off after 2-1, couldn't keep it for a few minutes at home. 3 goals in 10 minutes in any game is unacceptable but with 3 mins to go? They just switched off and that for me is worse than poor substitutions. They're both bad, I'm just annoyed it's always one or the other.

Not being funny Matt but if you remove two players who are retaining the outball and replace them with players who lose the ball and keep the most tired players on the pitch in midfield then you are effectively giving the fresh opponents an absolute gift.

If iraloa could have chosen 2 players to take off for us - he would have chosen dcl and ndiaye.

cant put it much more simple than that 

[Matt]

26 minutes ago, Hafnia said:

Not being funny Matt but if you remove two players who are retaining the outball and replace them with players who lose the ball and keep the most tired players on the pitch in midfield then you are effectively giving the fresh opponents an absolute gift.

If iraloa could have chosen 2 players to take off for us - he would have chosen dcl and ndiaye.

cant put it much more simple than that 

If players can't pass to their own team mates, that's on the players. I've held my hands up on Dyches culpability but excusing the players of any accountability is just blind to me. 

[Matt Tiger]

1 hour ago, Hafnia said:

Not being funny Matt but if you remove two players who are retaining the outball and replace them with players who lose the ball and keep the most tired players on the pitch in midfield then you are effectively giving the fresh opponents an absolute gift.

If iraloa could have chosen 2 players to take off for us - he would have chosen dcl and ndiaye.

cant put it much more simple than that 

Thrilled that many in this message board know better than the manager or even the players who was the most tired.

I can actually smell the hindsight bias when I open this thread!

[Hafnia]

1 hour ago, Matt said:

If players can't pass to their own team mates, that's on the players. I've held my hands up on Dyches culpability but excusing the players of any accountability is just blind to me. 

 Mate they were dead on their legs - ever played to the point you are done? The ability to pass a ball accurately goes as well as the ability to run. It's a well known fact and something dyche well knows. 

dyche screamed at Tim after a misplaced pass - he was absolutely done in and yet he kept him on? 

coleman could barely clear a ball. Sorry mate you were miles off to start with and you are miles off still - the players ran themselves into the ground and you are picking on them for the awful choices the manager made.