Zoo Posted January 26, 2012 Report Share Posted January 26, 2012 Looks for giant boom.....Bloody hell Zoo....you got a 'KA-BOOM'...only select few get KA's....and they ain't just for girls My life is now complete.. thanks J! The BU does/is doing far less damage then the current incumbant board. The club is currently dead on its feet due to gross mismanagement over the past 12 years or so. Bollocks. The Blue Union is doing more damage than anyone to Everton Football Club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwelterTheChef Posted January 26, 2012 Report Share Posted January 26, 2012 Affiliated with none of them, however I agree with them that change is required and that the board need to change their financial model because plan A isn't working, isn't sustainable and there doesn't appear to be a plan B. For the current board to have been sitting for this long and not one of them investing a single penny in that time is unforgivable. Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 26, 2012 Report Share Posted January 26, 2012 Bollocks. The Blue Union is doing more damage than anyone to Everton Football Club. I cant stand either side (bar Keoic), but I dont see what damage BU are doing. If the club had been run properly in the first place they would have even been the need for a BU. Kenwright in particular doesnt deserve some of the stick he is getting, BUT the board as a whole are continuing to bring this club to its knees. Exactly what the BU have done that is so damaging im not quite sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted January 26, 2012 Report Share Posted January 26, 2012 http://www.facebook.com/EfcABU http://www.dailymoti...nion-eabu_sport Excellent , sums up my thoughts on the entire sorry sage perfectly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted January 26, 2012 Report Share Posted January 26, 2012 I cant stand either side (bar Keoic), but I dont see what damage BU are doing. If the club had been run properly in the first place they would have even been the need for a BU. Kenwright in particular doesnt deserve some of the stick he is getting, BUT the board as a whole are continuing to bring this club to its knees. Exactly what the BU have done that is so damaging im not quite sure. Evertonians have generally got a decent reputation around the country but every time the Buffoon Union open their taxi door they seem determined to destroy that. How any true blue could bare to be associated with the moronic statements that these vile idiots churn out is beyond me. Im not stupid enough to believe that all the BU followers share the same opinion and Im sure some are decent guys and they must squirm with embarassment every time one of these idiots spouts off They are damaging the image of the club at every turn, if they had their way the clubs name would be getting dragged through the mud on the back page of every national newspaper and that would surely have an adverse effect on the players. If there was a potential buyer out there who was considering getting involved and he saw how the fans treated one of their own then Im sure they would think twice about it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted January 26, 2012 Report Share Posted January 26, 2012 So they admit to taping it now do they? Thanks for clarifying . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Blue Posted January 26, 2012 Report Share Posted January 26, 2012 I dont agree with every tactic the Blue Uinion use, but how would you show the fans displeasure at the board without them or a group like them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwelterTheChef Posted January 26, 2012 Report Share Posted January 26, 2012 To be honest I dont know, I don't follow them, or their releases, closely enough to remember. I pick up bits and pieces from other forums and from guys I talk to. However I have been of the consideration that the board need to go for long before BU formed. In fact the NTL and Kings Dock fiascos were the final straws. And it has been a catalogue of errors and blatant lies by the board since then. Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noble Savage Posted January 26, 2012 Report Share Posted January 26, 2012 (edited) I dont agree with every tactic the Blue Uinion use, but how would you show the fans displeasure at the board without them or a group like them? Exactly. A couple of the groups that form the Union had some decent points to make and put them across in an intelligent way without getting too personal about Bill. Then they joined with the Peoples group and it went tits up. However the Union will get my support as I trust then slightly more than I trust the Sainted one and his poor sidekick Bob. Edited January 26, 2012 by Noble Savage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) I dont agree with every tactic the Blue Uinion use, but how would you show the fans displeasure at the board without them or a group like them? Collect as many signatures as you can and send it to the club stating that if you get no response you'll go to the press. Have a balanced argument - accept what good has been done before pointing out the failings. Dont heckle people with the same moronic, inaccurate nonsense and sound like a bunch of sheep. Approach the business men as business men. There are a number of options in my opinion.... Edited January 27, 2012 by Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 Collect as many signatures as you can and send it to the club stating that if you get no response you'll go to the press. Have a balanced argument - accept what good has been done before pointing out the failings. Dont heckle people with the same moronic, inaccurate nonsense and sound like a bunch of sheep. Approach the business men as business men. There are a number of options in my opinion.... I agree! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 Collect as many signatures as you can and send it to the club stating that if you get no response you'll go to the press. Have a balanced argument - accept what good has been done before pointing out the failings. Dont heckle people with the same moronic, inaccurate nonsense and sound like a bunch of sheep. Approach the business men as business men. There are a number of options in my opinion.... I would go along with this however, the club are not representing themselves as business men, more like politicians. Before the Blue Union existed AGM's were banned, scornful replies by Kenwright, lies, failures, incompetence etc etc. Do they really deserve reprect as businessmen??? Business men have plans, they understand the customer, they engage with their clients - our club does not do this. Until the end of last year they had comical Ali Ross in charge of communications. The whole set up is a shambles. A member of my family works closely with Man United - they spoke to a couple of ex players (1970's era) - they are bewildered as to how the club is run, from the board room to tactics on the pitch. Pretty vocal about it, we are a well valued club based on our tradition and in their words "United would never be allowed to be run as shambolically - and a club like Everton should never be in the state they are" In the words of Villa's Director regarding David Gold - "When you get down in the mud and wrestle with a pig, the pig loves it - and you get muddy" same that can be said re the blue union and our current regime. It appears that many of our fans are prepared to sacrifice the need and urgency to get the club sold "by whatever means neccesary" for being seen as a decent bunch of fans - I couldn't care less. I can sooner tolerate ugly protests, media releases etc etc than I can the sale of another potentially world class youth product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 I would go along with this however, the club are not representing themselves as business men, more like politicians. Before the Blue Union existed AGM's were banned, scornful replies by Kenwright, lies, failures, incompetence etc etc. Do they really deserve reprect as businessmen??? Business men have plans, they understand the customer, they engage with their clients - our club does not do this. Until the end of last year they had comical Ali Ross in charge of communications. The whole set up is a shambles. A member of my family works closely with Man United - they spoke to a couple of ex players (1970's era) - they are bewildered as to how the club is run, from the board room to tactics on the pitch. Pretty vocal about it, we are a well valued club based on our tradition and in their words "United would never be allowed to be run as shambolically - and a club like Everton should never be in the state they are" In the words of Villa's Director regarding David Gold - "When you get down in the mud and wrestle with a pig, the pig loves it - and you get muddy" same that can be said re the blue union and our current regime. It appears that many of our fans are prepared to sacrifice the need and urgency to get the club sold "by whatever means neccesary" for being seen as a decent bunch of fans - I couldn't care less. I can sooner tolerate ugly protests, media releases etc etc than I can the sale of another potentially world class youth product. its not a matter of whether they deserve the respect or not Haf, because youre right in the sense its a political game and theyre not consulting with the fans enough. You have to be prepared to deal with arrogance, idiocy, ignorance and the rest in order to achieve your goal. You should suck it up and be the bigger man and most importantly bring all facts to the table, even those that go against your agenda. I cant tolerate these protests etc because the people doing them are not being balanced or objective, not even sticking to one of their founding statements. Theyre just a collective of people who arent happy and want to point the finger rather than make any changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 It's a difficult time for many, I do my best to not take things that the club do personally, nor do I get upset when people tag you as being part of something ugly. It's all a means to an end. The current regime have sat on hands, used every trick in the book, failed, manipulated and the unrest seen in some quarters is pure anger and at times hatred for the fact that for a time they had some people conned. The trust element has gone, many relations within the Everton family are toxic and beyond repair till the factors casuing the division are removed. It's not nice going through this, but it's because so many love the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 It's a difficult time for many, I do my best to not take things that the club do personally, nor do I get upset when people tag you as being part of something ugly. It's all a means to an end. The current regime have sat on hands, used every trick in the book, failed, manipulated and the unrest seen in some quarters is pure anger and at times hatred for the fact that for a time they had some people conned. The trust element has gone, many relations within the Everton family are toxic and beyond repair till the factors casuing the division are removed. It's not nice going through this, but it's because so many love the club. Just because its a difficult time doesnt mean protests and "action" groups shouldnt do things properly. Thats my biggest gripe. You want to protest and complain? Fine, go ahead! Just make sure you get your facts right, make sure all those who are on your side completely understand your argument and arent just going to take frustrations out. Most importantly have a balanced argument. Lookin at your last post where again you, like many others, have completely ignored any good that has been done, therefore dont have a balanced argument. These last couple of posts come mostly from experience in the last 18months of my job which is so close to being the same thing it makes me laugh. There is a huge amount of pressure and expectation here. But, even if i disagree with someone and go for a change, I do my research of both pros and cons of the argument, i sit down and listen to the management bullshit. I take my time, collecting as many people as I can to agree with my argument. Usually I win my arguments because of this. But sometimes, not matter how well you prepare, management often knows bits of information that Im not privvy to, because im not high up enough and dont have the right to know. So even if ive brought a well researched, solid argument based on all thats available to me, I can be shot down or ignored even by the people in charge. The Blue Union however will never get this far to be proven wrong because they dont do the ground work correctly, theyre not balanced and so from that alone, the board will never take them seriously Also, ts impossible not to take things personally when youre invested in something. To quote Ten "im not competitive, I just want to fuckin win!", thats how I think which is why i get so carried away and stressed with work and Everton. I want things to be the best they can be. Change is needed both in the job and at Everton, but it needs to be demonstrated in the correct way. Lastly, weve done this dance many times Haf and I think we have got a healthy mutual respect for the other even if we both think the others wrong. I dont want to dance any more today on this topic though if thats ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 Joined. I hate the Blue Union. I think it would be in the club's interest that Bill Kenwright left and we had a new chairman but I am 100% against the way that Kenwright has been treated. A man that has put his own money in his pocket for our club (albeit a small amount) does not deseve the abuse that he gets, the Blue Union are making the vasy majority of our supporters look like idiots and scumballs when in actual fact that Blue Union is a small minority of our fan-base. I remember a wonder post from Romey 1878 a while back who hit the nail on the head by basically saying - Bill Kenwright and the Blue Union bicker like children whilst the club we love goes under. The Blue Union does more harm than it does good and the sooner it is closed the better. May I just add a little humour to this debate? Bill puts his own money into his pocket, be certainly doesnt put what he has it into the club. He also doesnt put anyone elses in, including his other shareholders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 Just because its a difficult time doesnt mean protests and "action" groups shouldnt do things properly. Thats my biggest gripe. You want to protest and complain? Fine, go ahead! Just make sure you get your facts right, make sure all those who are on your side completely understand your argument and arent just going to take frustrations out. Most importantly have a balanced argument. Lookin at your last post where again you, like many others, have completely ignored any good that has been done, therefore dont have a balanced argument. These last couple of posts come mostly from experience in the last 18months of my job which is so close to being the same thing it makes me laugh. There is a huge amount of pressure and expectation here. But, even if i disagree with someone and go for a change, I do my research of both pros and cons of the argument, i sit down and listen to the management bullshit. I take my time, collecting as many people as I can to agree with my argument. Usually I win my arguments because of this. But sometimes, not matter how well you prepare, management often knows bits of information that Im not privvy to, because im not high up enough and dont have the right to know. So even if ive brought a well researched, solid argument based on all thats available to me, I can be shot down or ignored even by the people in charge. The Blue Union however will never get this far to be proven wrong because they dont do the ground work correctly, theyre not balanced and so from that alone, the board will never take them seriously Also, ts impossible not to take things personally when youre invested in something. To quote Ten "im not competitive, I just want to fuckin win!", thats how I think which is why i get so carried away and stressed with work and Everton. I want things to be the best they can be. Change is needed both in the job and at Everton, but it needs to be demonstrated in the correct way. Lastly, weve done this dance many times Haf and I think we have got a healthy mutual respect for the other even if we both think the others wrong. I dont want to dance any more today on this topic though if thats ok yeah i've quit dancing, I enjoy holding the score cards! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 I will look forward to you two dancing again. Strangely, I agree with both of you. Matt and Haf both have valid arguments, and I see both sides clearly. Unfortunately, I dont see the club ever being willing to sit down with anyone and discuss any issues, they wont talk to shareholders anymore, so what chance does anyone else have? Even when they did talk to the shareholders Bill openly refused to answer questions saying he was bored of them, bored of a question that he has never answered. Its things like this and the FSF that have filled me with nothing but anger towards Bill himself and the other board members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonButtle Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) Just because its a difficult time doesnt mean protests and "action" groups shouldnt do things properly. Thats my biggest gripe. You want to protest and complain? Fine, go ahead! Just make sure you get your facts right, make sure all those who are on your side completely understand your argument and arent just going to take frustrations out. Most importantly have a balanced argument. Lookin at your last post where again you, like many others, have completely ignored any good that has been done, therefore dont have a balanced argument. These last couple of posts come mostly from experience in the last 18months of my job which is so close to being the same thing it makes me laugh. There is a huge amount of pressure and expectation here. But, even if i disagree with someone and go for a change, I do my research of both pros and cons of the argument, i sit down and listen to the management bullshit. I take my time, collecting as many people as I can to agree with my argument. Usually I win my arguments because of this. But sometimes, not matter how well you prepare, management often knows bits of information that Im not privvy to, because im not high up enough and dont have the right to know. So even if ive brought a well researched, solid argument based on all thats available to me, I can be shot down or ignored even by the people in charge. The Blue Union however will never get this far to be proven wrong because they dont do the ground work correctly, theyre not balanced and so from that alone, the board will never take them seriously Also, ts impossible not to take things personally when youre invested in something. To quote Ten "im not competitive, I just want to fuckin win!", thats how I think which is why i get so carried away and stressed with work and Everton. I want things to be the best they can be. Change is needed both in the job and at Everton, but it needs to be demonstrated in the correct way. Lastly, weve done this dance many times Haf and I think we have got a healthy mutual respect for the other even if we both think the others wrong. I dont want to dance any more today on this topic though if thats ok I appreciate what you are saying Matt, but at what cost has that so-called 'Good' come at? the club is practically on its knees. Edited January 27, 2012 by theprisoner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 bored of a question that he has never answered. Very nice way of making that whole point. This is what scores heavily against Bill - he does not engage his brain before opening his mouth - watching him operate in a meeting must be like watching David Brent. His business rep must be all but shot by now. Not sure of the source but I recall somewhere it being said that LCC refuse to work with him again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 I appreciate what you are saying Matt, but at what cost has that so-called 'Good' come at? the club is practically on its knees. So-called good? Thats not very balanced There is some good that has come from the past 10 or so years, pretty sure ive gone through his further back in the thread Pris but to summarize - the record breaking deals (sales, merchandise - no matter how shit in comparison to others, still record breaking to EFC, which is what matters - etc) hadnt been done at the right time we'd be worse off than we are now. The good theyve done, apart from putting together a top team (when they can be bothered to play) with a top manager (when he can be bothered to manage), they have kept us afloat a bit longer, buying more time to hopefully find more investment (which can only be brought in if its out there) rather than letting us slump gradually. That is not to defend the board. They should be doing a better job but this is something that must be considered a positive. The club is also on its knees because it had to sell on and off field assets to bring in players to match expectation and to finance over-inflated contracts (Moyes, Arteta, Felli, Yak, Yobo, Cahill, Jags - all rumoured to be on over 50k a week). The 2nd biggest mistake the board made (after Kings Dock) was breaking the wage structure in my opinion when we didnt have the income to cover it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) I know you consider them things a positive Matt. But when you take your job into account, are you scored against how you did in previous years or against your competition? Could our record breaking deals just be due to inflation? If anyone ran a business for 12 years and consistently failed in financial terms (on the field performance can not be considered when reviewing off field as far as i'm concerned) they would either have their credit stopped or go bust, or both. Yes, he kept us afloat for longer, but by failing in every part of the company they have had to sell assets. I dont know about you, but if I presented anything in your post as a positive to my bosses i'd be out of a job. But then my bosses would have got rid of me long before now if they were my teams results (but i've only had eight months with this team, not 12 years). This is also without the lies of FSF to keep control of the club, when we had a man willing to invest. What ever anyone thought of Paul Gregg, given the chance I dont think he could have put us in a worse financial state than we have ended up in. Edited January 27, 2012 by StevO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 dude, youre missing my point. Theyre not doing a good job and we need something to change. But, in order to get those in charge to listen you have to acknowledge what they have done. Improvements, however small, are improvements and will be considered a good thing - thats not to say they shouldnt have done better. You then take the failings and list them in the same detail. Then they cant turn round and say "yes but we did this....." because youve already covered what they did. Accept what theyve done, acknowledge the achievements then go through all the failings. Then show points to improve and how to improve other than saying "this is shit, fix it". Its clear they dont know how to or its not possible to, so offer suggestions. Also, cant really compare you showing things to your boss because in this case you'd be showing the failings of the boss to the boss. You'd lose your job anyway! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 Ah, I think I get you now Matt. Sort of butter them up a bit? Hi Bill, I actully think you've done ok. Well done on getting the income up. And you've always stuck by Davie which is good. Lets not forget how good the lounges look since they got a refurb. Finch farm, impressive. But, seriously, we are up shit creek, sort it out mate. You got other board members, they have more cash than you, fucking milk them! Next years kit looks nice too. My boss would enjoy kicking my ass for them failings, but he is a baggies fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) Ah, I think I get you now Matt. Sort of butter them up a bit? Hi Bill, I actully think you've done ok. Well done on getting the income up. And you've always stuck by Davie which is good. Lets not forget how good the lounges look since they got a refurb. Finch farm, impressive. But, seriously, we are up shit creek, sort it out mate. You got other board members, they have more cash than you, fucking milk them! Next years kit looks nice too. My boss would enjoy kicking my ass for them failings, but he is a baggies fan. Not butter them up, acknowledge, but in essence the same thing. It will help show that youve done your research of all areas, not just the bits you want to change. Maybe be a little less patronizing and sarcastic in the letter too mate Edited January 27, 2012 by Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 Regarding DuncanMac's response to my post. I don't think the BU has cast any shadow (so to speak) over Everton supporters from an outsiders persepective, I think it is more an internal view, which I wouldn't totally disagree with. However we may look like a worse club in the media but that is purely because of the lies and spin the club kept feeding everyone, mainly through Kenwright. If you asked anyone from outside the club if they thought we were well run and managed and they would have said yes. We may have looked better as a club but the fact is that we haven't been well run at all. People now know more about the realities of Everton FC and while their views of us might not be what they were, they are at least realistic. I have to say I agree with pretty much all of what Matt has said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 Maybe that's what people are getting at.. some won't like that people's perception of the club's operaton is questioned. People in the media were saying what a well run club were and then the interview came out where Bill Kenwright says he doesn't know where the money goes and that he almost sold the club to a scammer etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted January 27, 2012 Report Share Posted January 27, 2012 Maybe that's what people are getting at.. some won't like that people's perception of the club's operaton is questioned. People in the media were saying what a well run club were and then the interview came out where Bill Kenwright says he doesn't know where the money goes and that he almost sold the club to a scammer etc. Yeh exactly. They were given the illusion that everything was rosy when in reality it wasnt. I dont think that the fact it has been brought to light is a bad thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 http://www.evertonfc.com/news/archive/2012/01/28/forum-heads-to-finch-farm Step in the right direction from the board side? Not getting carried away thinking it undoes the mistakes of the past but its a positive sign Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonButtle Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 http://www.evertonfc...s-to-finch-farm Step in the right direction from the board side? Not getting carried away thinking it undoes the mistakes of the past but its a positive sign sorry but id say it was complete FAIL, it's too late to start buttering people up with tours here and there, clutching at straws is what it is imo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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