Romey 1878 Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 How much is it going to cost to employ these professionals and how would they be any different than whatt Kieth Harris is doing? No idea how much it'd cost, but if the payment was based entirely on a successful takeover then that would suit all parties surely? It'd make the hired help as determined as possible to make it happen and the boardmembers would get to make a pretty penny. Keith Harris is someone we should be steering clear of based on what BK himself has said about the parties that he's been introduced to in the past. It's an indication of how clueless the board are that they continue to turn to Harris even after the crap that he's brought their way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Martyr - a person who sacrifices something of great value and especially life itself for the sake of principle. (Had to look this up!) It doesn't matter how much of a sacrafice Bill makes really because the fact is Earl and Woods still own almost as much as him - there are at least 3 parties to satisfy here initially and although I can kind of see why people would expect Kenwright to make sacrafices, what are peoples expectations of Earl and Woods? Earl and Woods are the biggest problem standing in the way of us being sold, IMO, and probably Earl more so than Woods. BUT, BK brought Earl onboard as an ally so if it is Earl that's a problem then Kenwright has made a rod for his own back there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 (edited) Ah quit with all the bollocks and analogies plain and simple we need a new owner with abit of money who when why and how much has fcuk all to do with us sadly and when it happens it happens.... I'm tired of the same old shite each year we all know what needs to happen the way to go about it we differ in opinion, We all want the best for the club in our own way. Edited November 20, 2011 by EFC-Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonButtle Posted November 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 (edited) Earl and Woods are the biggest problem standing in the way of us being sold, IMO, and probably Earl more so than Woods. BUT, BK brought Earl onboard as an ally so if it is Earl that's a problem then Kenwright has made a rod for his own back there. BK has borrowed money in the past from Earl, maybe he needs a large profit to be able to pay it back, nevertheless if it is that, like you suggested Rom, then Bill only has himself to blame. Edited November 20, 2011 by theprisoner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanmckenzieismagic Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Not quite the same though is it... If I had been trying to sell my house for however many years Kenwright claims to have been, and still been unable to sell it, then having someone else come in and help me out certainly wouldnt go amiss. I believe these people are called estate agents lol . Your missing my point Haf said they should be able to come and sell the club for whatever price they want not one that suits the board. Unless of cause you would be happy for an estate agent to selll your house for less than what you beleive it to be worth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LexKing Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Hmm, was on finnish newspaper that we have actually 2 groups trying to buy us... other were some group from India and other is some Sheik? from middle east who already is in football, having pieces of Malaga and some french club. He wants a team from prem and would wanna invest totally of 500M(dont remember what money) wich should include the prize of the team he buys. Sry about my bad memory, cant write better what was on there. Wouldnt even wrote this, but were so surprised of those mentions on papers. Usually EFC is mentioned only on injurylists. Well, actually EFC were said couple weeks ago an top club, when finnish 13y "supertalent" joined our youth academy. That was the longest post including EFC ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Ah quit with all the bollocks and analogies plain and simple we need a new owner with abit of money who when why and how much has fcuk all to do with us sadly and when it happens it happens.... I'm tired of the same old shite each year we all know what needs to happen the way to go about it we differ in opinion, We all want the best for the club in our own way. I sniggered typing each character of mine - they're getting ridiculous!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 I sniggered typing each character of mine - they're getting ridiculous!!! I was already impressed by your post....if it was done with irony I'm even more impressed . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c1982 Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 I was already impressed by your post....if it was done with irony I'm even more impressed . Oh stop it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Martyr - a person who sacrifices something of great value and especially life itself for the sake of principle. (Had to look this up!) It doesn't matter how much of a sacrafice Bill makes really because the fact is Earl and Woods each own almost as much as him - there are at least 3 parties to satisfy here initially and although I can kind of see why people would expect Kenwright to make sacrafices, what are peoples expectations of Earl and Woods? I agree and as I said, I dont expect him to be making these sacrifices if I am honest. However, he needs to stear clear of trying to paint this type of picture, which in one way or another he seems to do every time he opens his mouth. Your missing my point Haf said they should be able to come and sell the club for whatever price they want not one that suits the board. Unless of cause you would be happy for an estate agent to selll your house for less than what you beleive it to be worth Well that wasnt the understanding I got from Haf's posts. However, continuing with this awful house theme, surely the estate agent will know a lot more about the market that the seller, and is thus more qualified to know the true value of your house, especially if all the other properties down your street are all in better nick, dont need redecorating and cost less to maintain. The market dictates the price, and clearly after all these years, BK and his cronies seem to think their 2 bedroom flat in Croxeth is a luxury penthouse apartment in London. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 If the buyer isn't willing to pay the price, he will not have the funds/balls to take us to the next level. It will just be another businessman after a profit eg. Mike Ashley. We need a billionaire otherwise it's pointless selling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 If the buyer isn't willing to pay the price, he will not have the funds/balls to take us to the next level. It will just be another businessman after a profit eg. Mike Ashley. We need a billionaire otherwise it's pointless selling. Just because someone isn't willing to pay the asking price doesn't mean they don't have the funds to actually pay the price though, it just means that they don't agree with the asking price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 If the buyer isn't willing to pay the price, he will not have the funds/balls to take us to the next level. It will just be another businessman after a profit eg. Mike Ashley. We need a billionaire otherwise it's pointless selling. No-one these days is going to buy over the odds for a football club, as its not easy to make money from. We need someone who is going to be smart, use money wisely and gradually build us back to where we should be. I personally dont want to see an Abramovic or Sheikh come in a ruin our identity, treating the history and tradition of the club as a mere play thing. We need new direction and new leadership to make Everton as a business work so that the club will always have a future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 No-one these days is going to buy over the odds for a football club, as its not easy to make money from. We need someone who is going to be smart, use money wisely and gradually build us back to where we should be. I personally dont want to see an Abramovic or Sheikh come in a ruin our identity, treating the history and tradition of the club as a mere play thing. We need new direction and new leadership to make Everton as a business work so that the club will always have a future. There's no way some one can come in and build a team and make a profit. There's only two types of buyers either a billionaire looking for a hobby or a businessman looking for a quick profit. The only way we'd get the best of both worlds was if our brand was more renown eg. Liverpool. Something like a 'Lerner' type would have been ideal a few years back, but now the gaps too big. We have to rely on scouting, training, and a good manager now, which is how football should be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noble Savage Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 We have to rely on scouting, training, and a good manager now, which is how football should be. It really should be but it isn't I'm afraid. What annoys me most (more than lack of a warchest) is the real possibility that those youngsters and relative unknowns our tremendous scouts pick up are sold to cover the Fuck ups made at board level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 http://www.nsno.co.uk/everton-news/2011/11/sharp-indian-takeover-has-gone-quiet/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+NilSatisNisiOptimumNews+%28Nil+Satis+Nisi+Optimum%29 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 If the buyer isn't willing to pay the price, he will not have the funds/balls to take us to the next level. It will just be another businessman after a profit eg. Mike Ashley. We need a billionaire otherwise it's pointless selling. we dont, if we had someone just come and stop the rot (pay the debts) the club could function from its own income. a multi-millionaire would be more than enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 we dont, if we had someone just come and stop the rot (pay the debts) the club could function from its own income. a multi-millionaire would be more than enough. That would be ideal, but realistically there's more chance of finding a billionaire than a millionaire martyr. Which doesn't really give us any chance. If the clubs say £160 mil including debt, then a stadium on top for minimum £200 mil, plus player investment and additional running cost(higher wages), you'd be mad to buy us unless you had the disposable cash a billionaire does and even then your sanity should be checked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 well really any figure is only for around 70% of the club anyway, its not to buy out every shareholder. we dont NEED a stadium. GP will last for years to come. If the debts were clear and we started to run properly as a business and were frugal with money as well as looking after the playing squad, the stadium could be looked at again in five years and see where we are then. The stadium issue is all to do with other grounds having more corp facilities, well we have very good corp facilities, we dont have many but what we do have are excellent, yet we still dont sell them out. GP can easily last another decade, its not falling down (part of the kirkby spin imo). We could get away with someone buying out the three major shareholders, paying off the debt and throwing £15m at the squad initially, then just try to run as a business for five years, see where that takes us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 Totally agree Steve, If more people adopted that view and approach to the situation there would be alot less hassle moaning and general bitching. A fair few fans (GOT) want a mega rich Sheikh to come in and knock City off the chart but where would we stand in 5/10 years time if that? I would much rather we do it that way (if possible) with the uncertainty over what state these billionaires will leave clubs in. Steady the ship, further develop youth and have the funds if need be to buy a player rather then use loans and drip payments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EFC-Paul Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 No big ask surely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FanchesterCity Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 I agree you don't NEED a stadium. But it does hold you back a fair amount. There's basically two ways to go: 1) A new stadium with room for expansion offers you a nice 'clean' slate to market the club with, and significantly improves corporate hospitality and image. LIke it or lump up, the sponsors all want 'modern, going forwards' type imagery that a new stadium can offer - along with the extra capacity and potential facilities in and around the stadium 2) Stick with what you've got (which is perfectly fine). Accept it's holding you back a bit, but make the most of what you have - market Goodison's history better, and make it part of the appeal. (I know it appeals to YOU the fans, but you need to make it appeal to sponsors). I think EFC-Paul's right to be unsure about the state a club might be in in 5/10 years with megarich owners (but I also think it's fair to wonder what might happen to those not getting on the 'elite' train). When I say 'elite' train - I'm talking about the relentless CL money, and all the revenue that comes with it (along with 'star' players et al). I LOATHE the way the game's been going for the last 20 years, but it's showing no sign of stopping, just getting worse. What IF they form an 'Elite' Euro League? or split the Prem into two? I don't trust ANY of FIFA / UEFA / PL or for that matter the FA. They'll shaft anybody they need to to make more money. I genuinely worry that in the next 10 years some of our greatest clubs will fall by the wayside (or those that tried to become elite (like City) will fall). Someone, somewhere is going to get hurt - I'm SURE of it! Now, I swear I'm not knocking Everton - but I think it's right to say "steady the ship". If the worst came to the worst and Everton didn't end up in the 'elite' - so be it, at least Everton would still exist. Who's to say that City won't be like Leeds... 5 years in the sun then 20 years in the wilderness? Again, it's not knocking Everton - there's plenty of United and City fans who would still rather be in the positions they are in as opposed to Everton's BUT many of us also know that both clubs COULD be a looming disaster too. Maybe it's just pessimism, but I'm not comfortable with it all, and many like me feel the same way. It's great fun whilst it lasts... Sadly, who else is left in the world to buy PL clubs? the 'local hero' types (BK) are few and far between, and their pockets are rarely deep enough now. The only ones who can afford it are folks with an 'agenda' (and it's NEVER the long term future of the club per se). Their agenda might be favourable to the club, or not, but the prime goal isn't City / Everton / United etc etc, it's THEM, their image, their other businesses, their affiliates. Football clubs are now the equivalent of a well positioned billboard. The better positioned, the more it's worth, but all they want is the advertising space it offers. :-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 Kenwright has never had the money to own us, he had to borrow and bring in others - a big part of the problem I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 On GOT: "just to keep the lads up to date who have been p,m me , kenwrights valuation of the club is holding up talks of the takeover. there looks to be every chance pienarr could be coming back to goody park from what am told" seems a highly respected 'sourced' poster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bailey Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 well really any figure is only for around 70% of the club anyway, its not to buy out every shareholder. we dont NEED a stadium. GP will last for years to come. If the debts were clear and we started to run properly as a business and were frugal with money as well as looking after the playing squad, the stadium could be looked at again in five years and see where we are then. The stadium issue is all to do with other grounds having more corp facilities, well we have very good corp facilities, we dont have many but what we do have are excellent, yet we still dont sell them out. GP can easily last another decade, its not falling down (part of the kirkby spin imo). We could get away with someone buying out the three major shareholders, paying off the debt and throwing £15m at the squad initially, then just try to run as a business for five years, see where that takes us. I agree with this completely. It wont solve our problems over night, but gradually over a period of time we can build a sustainable squad, bringing in youth players with a moderate amount to buy players in. Create a consistent wage structure and aim to bring through decent youth players as well as getting in one decent signing a season, and if we really wanted to splash the cash, then someone would have to go first. Yes I admit the stadium issue is a stumbling block to reaching the next level, but GP will do for now and Im still fairly confident a new Park End could be built for a reasonable fee if it is deemed necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonButtle Posted November 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 well really any figure is only for around 70% of the club anyway, its not to buy out every shareholder. we dont NEED a stadium. GP will last for years to come. If the debts were clear and we started to run properly as a business and were frugal with money as well as looking after the playing squad, the stadium could be looked at again in five years and see where we are then. The stadium issue is all to do with other grounds having more corp facilities, well we have very good corp facilities, we dont have many but what we do have are excellent, yet we still dont sell them out. GP can easily last another decade, its not falling down (part of the kirkby spin imo). We could get away with someone buying out the three major shareholders, paying off the debt and throwing £15m at the squad initially, then just try to run as a business for five years, see where that takes us. GP will not last for years to come mate, we need it to help increase income, and whilst it still has its limited corporate facilities and its restricted viewing for fans, and there are long term rumours over the safety of the place, id say GP is something we cannot rely on whatsoever imo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 GP will not last for years to come mate, we need it to help increase income, and whilst it still has its limited corporate facilities and its restricted viewing for fans, and there are long term rumours over the safety of the place, id say GP is something we cannot rely on whatsoever imo sorry pris but thats rubbish. if it wasnt safe it would not get the certificate, they havent had to do any strength work on the buildings or anything like that to suggest there is a safety issue. football grounds are heavily scrutinised on safety after the terrible events, so there is no way any safety issues can be there. the thing people dont seem to understand is that yes, we do have limited corporate facilities, but they are still empty. we dont have the pull of some of our neighbours to bring more in. we can go and build a stadium, put in loads of corps, fill them for a couple of season with the "new stadium effect", then after the hype has died down, we go back to not selling them. the restricted views, fair enough, its rare they get sold out. but thats only around 5,000 seats, that wont make great in roads into the finances. say we build a 50,000 seater, with no restrictions that would be an extra 15,000 seats when sold out, at £40 a ticket thats £600,000 per game extra, but more supporters means the police want more money, the security firm want more money, need more stewards, the catering company want more money. we wont be able to work like Arsenal with the emirates used to capacity every day, companies have a lot of alternatives in the town centre, how do you convince them to come away from that to walton, or edge lane, or the lancs? a new stadium anywhere might help a little bit, but its not going to help a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 sorry pris but thats rubbish. if it wasnt safe it would not get the certificate, they havent had to do any strength work on the buildings or anything like that to suggest there is a safety issue. football grounds are heavily scrutinised on safety after the terrible events, so there is no way any safety issues can be there. the thing people dont seem to understand is that yes, we do have limited corporate facilities, but they are still empty. we dont have the pull of some of our neighbours to bring more in. we can go and build a stadium, put in loads of corps, fill them for a couple of season with the "new stadium effect", then after the hype has died down, we go back to not selling them. the restricted views, fair enough, its rare they get sold out. but thats only around 5,000 seats, that wont make great in roads into the finances. say we build a 50,000 seater, with no restrictions that would be an extra 15,000 seats when sold out, at £40 a ticket thats £600,000 per game extra, but more supporters means the police want more money, the security firm want more money, need more stewards, the catering company want more money. we wont be able to work like Arsenal with the emirates used to capacity every day, companies have a lot of alternatives in the town centre, how do you convince them to come away from that to walton, or edge lane, or the lancs? a new stadium anywhere might help a little bit, but its not going to help a lot. agree with everything except the bit in bold - Arsenal are in the capital which has maaaaany more alternatives yet they still pull people to the Emirates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 sorry pris but thats rubbish. if it wasnt safe it would not get the certificate, they havent had to do any strength work on the buildings or anything like that to suggest there is a safety issue. football grounds are heavily scrutinised on safety after the terrible events, so there is no way any safety issues can be there. the thing people dont seem to understand is that yes, we do have limited corporate facilities, but they are still empty. we dont have the pull of some of our neighbours to bring more in. we can go and build a stadium, put in loads of corps, fill them for a couple of season with the "new stadium effect", then after the hype has died down, we go back to not selling them. the restricted views, fair enough, its rare they get sold out. but thats only around 5,000 seats, that wont make great in roads into the finances. say we build a 50,000 seater, with no restrictions that would be an extra 15,000 seats when sold out, at £40 a ticket thats £600,000 per game extra, but more supporters means the police want more money, the security firm want more money, need more stewards, the catering company want more money. we wont be able to work like Arsenal with the emirates used to capacity every day, companies have a lot of alternatives in the town centre, how do you convince them to come away from that to walton, or edge lane, or the lancs? a new stadium anywhere might help a little bit, but its not going to help a lot. 'If we don’t leave Goodison soon the place will lose its safety certificate' – Bill Kenwright, December 2007. In which case, I agree with you SteveO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 'If we don’t leave Goodison soon the place will lose its safety certificate' – Bill Kenwright, December 2007. In which case, I agree with you SteveO cant help yourself can you? Can you define soon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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