markjazzbassist Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 When I said Messi has a poor touch... surely the sarcasm must have registered? He's technically the most brilliant player on the planet... by some distance too. no one is arguing that, just like no one argues that rom scores goals. i did mention that some of the best in the world aren't consistent and don't work hard off the ball (which rom sometimes does/doens't) to bring some parity, but it was discarded by those "rom-deniers" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newty82 Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 When I said Messi has a poor touch... surely the sarcasm must have registered? He's technically the most brilliant player on the planet... by some distance too. Ha. Yeah. I got a bit mixed up. Sarcasm using Lukaku's stats I guess?!!! Or something. Anyway, moving swiftly on..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 no one is arguing that, just like no one argues that rom scores goals. i did mention that some of the best in the world aren't consistent and don't work hard off the ball (which rom sometimes does/doens't) to bring some parity, but it was discarded by those "rom-deniers" Rom isn't good enough not to work - simple as that. Even then I don't like watching idle players. That's one thing I always admired about Rooney. Watched a programme about le tissier the other night.... absolutely phenomenal talent. He talks about how many of his team mates never supported him when souness called him out for his laziness in the changing room....only Francis benali did and maybe one or 2 others. This is a player who effectively scored goals at the rate of a striker from midfield... he averaged 20 premier league goals a season for his first 3 seasons as a prem player.... for a pretty poor club and he was called out for laziness... So a player who averaged that rate from midfield for a pretty poor team was called out for laziness and not supported ? Tells you what fellow pros think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddock Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 Rom isn't good enough not to work - simple as that. Even then I don't like watching idle players. That's one thing I always admired about Rooney. Watched a programme about le tissier the other night.... absolutely phenomenal talent. He talks about how many of his team mates never supported him when souness called him out for his laziness in the changing room....only Francis benali did and maybe one or 2 others. This is a player who effectively scored goals at the rate of a striker from midfield... he averaged 20 premier league goals a season for his first 3 seasons as a prem player.... for a pretty poor club and he was called out for laziness... So a player who averaged that rate from midfield for a pretty poor team was called out for laziness and not supported ? Tells you what fellow pros think. He is good enough not to work if he has the players around him Messi does. No- he's not on Messis level but he is one of the best finishers in the world so put him in a team the does the work and let him put the ball in the net. Everyone is payed to do a different job. Matt and markjazzbassist 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 This is my problem with the idea of "rounded" players. It means they don't do anything exceptional, and so will struggle to deliver excellence. I prefer to have a collection of players who are exceptional experts in their fields, and play to their strengths. If you do this, then you excel and that's how you win things SimonButtle and markjazzbassist 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 1985 a team of very good players with no superstars. Arguably the best team in Europe of that era. But I suppose football has changed a lot since those days. Maybe you do need specialists in areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 1985 a team of very good players with no superstars. Arguably the best team in Europe of that era. But I suppose football has changed a lot since those days. Maybe you do need specialists in areas. too young for that. The Leicester argument, which will inevitably turn up, is also void in my opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 Just to clarify further. Having experts is no guarantee, not to mention expensive and a loooooong term project, so rounded players have their place. But when goals win games, as well as GK and defence, these ares must be the areas to have exceptional talents Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Steve Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 Pages of crap about Lukaku's poor performance against WHam. What about Mirallas? He was much worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 Rom heard Karen Brady say she wanted to buy him. He was just trying to put them off, that's all. Calm down lads, it was job done and back on the coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 This is my problem with the idea of "rounded" players. It means they don't do anything exceptional, and so will struggle to deliver excellence. I prefer to have a collection of players who are exceptional experts in their fields, and play to their strengths. If you do this, then you excel and that's how you win things Rounded Players? Gazza, Rooney,Gerrard, Suarez, Messi, beckenbauer, van basten, gullit, cruyf, matthaus, seedorf, mascherano, zannetti, maldini, maradona, giggs, willian, Every single one of them rounded and most certainly excel in at least 1 element of the game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 Pages of crap about Lukaku's poor performance against WHam. What about Mirallas? He was much worse. Happy to discuss it... 13/20 passes... no completed take ons, pretty shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 Rounded Players? Gazza, Rooney,Gerrard, Suarez, Messi, beckenbauer, van basten, gullit, cruyf, matthaus, seedorf, mascherano, zannetti, maldini, maradona, giggs, willian, Every single one of them rounded and most certainly excel in at least 1 element of the game Willian aside (and you missed a fuck ton but I'm on my phone so can't add to the list) you've quoted world class players. I mean all time all XI contenders. Case and point Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 Willian aside (and you missed a fuck ton but I'm on my phone so can't add to the list) you've quoted world class players. I mean all time all XI contenders. Case and point "This is my problem with the idea of "rounded" players. It means they don't do anything exceptional, and so will struggle to deliver excellence." If a player is rounded and excels in more than one area they are likely to be world class... i will carry on the more sanitised version if that helps? Fabregas, rikyaard, gudjohnsen, henry, alonso, bergkamp, le bouef, vidal, schweinsteiger, abidal, puyol, Silva, morientes, There is a shed load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeO Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 "This is my problem with the idea of "rounded" players. It means they don't do anything exceptional, and so will struggle to deliver excellence." If a player is rounded and excels in more than one area they are likely to be world class... i will carry on the more sanitised version if that helps? Fabregas, rikyaard, gudjohnsen, henry, alonso, bergkamp, le bouef, vidal, schweinsteiger, abidal, puyol, Silva, morientes, There is a shed load. Fairly certain all of those players would be very happy to have Rom in their team, ignoring era differentials of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC11 Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 (edited) Someone who's a clinical finisher but a rough footballer. He's certainly improved but he couldn't lace the boots of any of the above mentioned players in terms of all round ability. He's a tier below those. He's going to be a Drogba type player at best. Yes up there with the elite but unorthodox and not easy on the eye. He is improving though. He's improved 10 fold since he came here. Edited April 26, 2017 by MC11 holystove, Lowensda and Matt 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevO Posted April 26, 2017 Report Share Posted April 26, 2017 Exactly what MC says. Also, not many of the players mentioned would have come to Everton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 Exactly what MC says. Also, not many of the players mentioned would have come to Everton. I think the key kicker is Everton were the only club who were prepared to pay £28m for him. Simple as that. We were his only option if he wanted to play football. It's probably the reason he has always talked about moving since he got here. We weren't his ideal club and took me hasn't he let it show. I maintain that his level of footballing ability is poor. It is way below the standard you expect from a premier league player. When you compare his passing, control, hold up play, aerial ability, work rate to a player like kone or valencia it looks a level below. It is only because of his athleticism and finishing that he is who he is. For me I expect our next forward to have a footballing ability above the likes of Valencia with with a good level of finishing. I believe we would flourish as a team I really do. If man United are interested I would demand Marcus Rashford as part of the deal. I believe he is destined for the absolute top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete0 Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 (edited) I think the key kicker is Everton were the only club who were prepared to pay £28m for him. Simple as that. We were his only option if he wanted to play football. It's probably the reason he has always talked about moving since he got here. We weren't his ideal club and took me hasn't he let it show. I maintain that his level of footballing ability is poor. It is way below the standard you expect from a premier league player. When you compare his passing, control, hold up play, aerial ability, work rate to a player like kone or valencia it looks a level below. It is only because of his athleticism and finishing that he is who he is. For me I expect our next forward to have a footballing ability above the likes of Valencia with with a good level of finishing. I believe we would flourish as a team I really do. If man United are interested I would demand Marcus Rashford as part of the deal. I believe he is destined for the absolute top. The reason he went for so much is because West Ham tried to gazump us. Brady bragged they pushed the price up, and said he knocked them back in two windows. Edited April 27, 2017 by pete0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 (edited) "This is my problem with the idea of "rounded" players. It means they don't do anything exceptional, and so will struggle to deliver excellence." If a player is rounded and excels in more than one area they are likely to be world class... i will carry on the more sanitised version if that helps? Fabregas, rikyaard, gudjohnsen, henry, alonso, bergkamp, le bouef, vidal, schweinsteiger, abidal, puyol, Silva, morientes, There is a shed load. are you seeing the names you're writing down? Youre just emphasising my points Edited April 27, 2017 by Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 (edited) are you seeing the names you're writing down? Youre just emphasising my pointsYou said rounded players who excel in an area of the game don't really exist... they do. I'll carry on.... Ashley Cole, Rio Ferdinand, David Platt, Dublin, Steve mcmannaman, Robbie Fowler, Zola, viera, sheringham... They do. And guess what... if they were all playing today only a handful of them at most would be valued at the £80m-£100m daft price we are hearing about a player who is not a patch on them from an all round perspective. Edited April 27, 2017 by Hafnia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shukes Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 Haf you were doing well.... then you said Kone! Valencia is a better player than Kone, and I know you were on about the technical side more....I don't think Kone is as good as you say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 Haf you were doing well.... then you said Kone! Valencia is a better player than Kone, and I know you were on about the technical side more....I don't think Kone is as good as you say. Kone is finished. As a footballer before his injuries he was tidy enough - good at holding it up. Strong in the air, actually could take a man on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 I give up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 Haf you were doing well.... then you said Kone! Valencia is a better player than Kone, and I know you were on about the technical side more....I don't think Kone is as good as you say. Kone is finished. As a footballer before his injuries he was tidy enough - good at holding it up. Strong in the air, actually could take a man on. That's my point- he was actually ok at the all round stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaron Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 Did I honestly just see Morientes name being mentioned at being better than Rom? Great for Real with a bucket load of great players around him, put him at the shite where the quality in players dropped and he fucking flopped, majorly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romey 1878 Posted April 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 I give up no you don't! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 no you don't! For now I do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavisJD Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 Quality striker, fingers crossed we hold onto him for minimum 1 more season. We need Rom to push to win the title next year. Yes I said title, why would you start with any less ambition before you've even kicked a ball? aaron 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafnia Posted April 27, 2017 Report Share Posted April 27, 2017 Did I honestly just see Morientes name being mentioned at being better than Rom? Great for Real with a bucket load of great players around him, put him at the shite where the quality in players dropped and he fucking flopped, majorly. No... I was asked to provide a list of rounded players who excelled in other aspects of the game. Morientes could do the lot up front but was exceptional in the air... good at free kicks too. Jari litmanen... theres another all rounder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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