Avinalaff

I'm not the person to discuss tactics Pete. It's 30 years since I played football, and I'm not sure I received the wisdom of a professional coach too often.

He doesn't have the money for wide players, so like every great manager he becomes resourceful. There are worse players on the wing in the Premiership than Coleman and Drenthe, even if they're not perfect. Take a look at how much players cost Steve, and then figure out how much money we would need to put the players you want in the positions you feel they should play. Then come back to me with a figure.

Steve, I have a little business acumen, as I worked for a national company for many years, and as you know I've been self employed too, but I don't have enough experience at the required level to pass judgement, nor have I qualifications in accountancy, as I paid accountants to do that for me. I'm confident we will survive because it is good business for the banks for us to be in debt, even if it meant selling everything we had to clear some of it and starting again. After 40 years of supporting the club, I'm prepared to take a step backwards in order for the club to survive. I put my own ego, or feelings to one side. If the club win the title, it doesn't change our lives, nor does it change our lives if they are relegated. It simply changes the fixture list. What I deem to be survival, and what you deem to be survival may or may not be the same, but survive it will.

I'm not being sarcastic when I say I'm not the guy to be discussing tactics with, but I will say that no matter what game plan you have, it's important that the pieces you move are up to the job. How can he use the same tactics with different players? I don't see too much wrong with his tactics either to be fair. We have 4 defenders, like most teams I know, and play 4-5-1, as a basic line up, with differences occasionally that are beyond my capacity as a poster to properly describe. We have our best players on the pitch, and the majority of them play in the correct position, with the exception of Moyes having to improvise the wings. If we were to play every player in position, we would not have 11 players on the field. It's that simple. Look at the teams around you, and they have 2 or 3 players per position, and each are top class internationals. We are not that fortunate. People talk about Owen Coyle, but what has he done that is so impressive, other than jump ship and leave Burnley to sink? Would it be a good idea to merge the 2 Moyes threads, so as to keep track of each conversation?

I look at it from as many angles as I can Steve. I don't have all the answers mate. Heck, I don't even have all the questions, but I do know that most of the fans who want changes, don't know what changes are needed. They just like to jump on the band wagon. It would be naive to think the board don't have the best interests of 'their' club at heart, and it would be even more naive to think at that level of business, they aren't qualified to address the matters, should a solution present itself. The biggest crime of naivety is to think the fans know better than the board. To even discuss the matter takes far more information than we have been furnished with in order to avoid speculation, and even if we had all the information at hand, most of us wouldn't know what to do with it, or understand what the figures represented. It's not what we do. It 'is' what they do. I'm confident that the club will survive, and if it means a trip to a lower division for a while in order to do that then so be it. It didn't do Newcastle any harm.

I'm not qualified enough to discuss his tactics Steve. I'm not a pro footballer or manager, nor am I in the room when he is discussing the tactics with the team, so can't grasp his game plan from pure speculation. If I spoke about it with him, I'd be better able to challenge it, but it's been a while since myself and Dave had lunch whilst discussing the teams flaws. I'm sure he'll ring me when he wants my advice.

We have 3 good defenders. Play the 2 that are in form at any one time. Let them know that mistakes means a week or 2 on the bench.

Ste, that's crazy talk. There are professional people in place to run the club. Is your worrying going to change anything? Is your complaining going to change anything? Is sacking Moyes going to change anything? Please don't presume that just because people aren't doom and gloom mongerers that they aren't aware of the situation, or at least any less than the next fan. There is one thing to be concerned, and another to be misguided. The quickest way to save the club is to stop being so demanding, and settle for what we have. It's not the club that is the problem, but the fans.

Could you do the job Haf? Tell me yes and I'll gladly put a mention in for you.

Haf, Tell me a single thing about Everton in which you are happy, and it would be a good start. This seems to be always the same lads mixing it with the same lads, which isn't going to change. Had guys like yourself discussed positives as well as negatives, there wouldn't be so many locks on the windows from those who feel this negative attitude is a poison running through the blue vein. I've not seen a single point raised by the BU, or even your good self, which quite frankly isn't a moan. Look at football, and see what has happened to it.

There lies the problem Pris. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing, as some might say. An example might be where a customer complains about the price of a pie, or a ticket, or a fare, yet does so without knowledge of all the operating costs, which won't be disclosed to them, as it's not their business, and is the private matter of the businessman. Should he have to explain his private affairs in order to appease the customer, or should the customer go shop elsewhere if they're unhappy? It's a vicious circle, but one that exists in many factors at our club, from back room staff decisions to board room affairs. The Blue Union want Kenwright to sell the club. Why? So they can be owned by billionaires and win trophies. Is that not a little self centred and over expectant? Telling a business man to sell his business to another? If I was Kenwright I'd tell them to go support another club if they're not happy. It's time fans realised that Everton is a business. Fans do not have a say.

Tactics are controversial Haf. That was why I quoted a chess game, and the uneven sides, and also why I stated about fans not seeing the players like Moyes does. It needs to be proven with a full squad, and we don't have that.

It's about expectation levels, and being realistic. We were at Wembley recently, enjoying European football, and playing great stuff on the pitch. That wasn't too long ago. We've had little funding other than what Moyes has created himself from shrewd management, and have lot key players in the mix. Meanwhile other teams have spent heavily, and not just the top teams, but even the lower teams. The lower teams are still not as good as we are despite their spending, which shows how good Moyes made the squad, but how does he keep it going? It's like asking an artist to paint a masterpiece without giving him brushes, paint, or inspiration. City have spent £800m on their 25 players including wages, and probably a billion on their whole squad. City are now able to compete with the big clubs, but what chance do we, or anybody else have? To decide whether we have experienced good times, we have to look at 'everybody' and not just those with power.

Are you talking about the 3 lads who taped the conversation behind Kenwrights back Haf? They might tie a chairmen in knots, but they certainly wouldn't tie the company accountants in knots, with the difference being that Kenwright isn't an accountant. I haven't called them thick. I simply commented on how they appear. They certainly 'are' uneducated though, in the respect of not having all the facts, as opposed to not going to school, which in turn turns most of their arguments into 'opinions' rather than facts.

It's not looking stale because of Moyes though Haf. Moyes is a victim of circumstance just like we are.

Have we not had a good 10 years under Moyes? I think the good times are still with us. We might not be winning titles, but we're hardly propping the division up every year either. We need to forget silverware. Silverware was a thing of the past, contested between teams that all had a good shout. Football is no longer an even playing field, and even if we were taken over, what about the other teams who aren't taken over? What of their fate? Are we so selfish as Everton fans that we hate the money in football, only if we aren't getting any, but if we do get some, then hey ho, I'm alright Jack? I don't think we are. Most would like a level playing field for all. Is the answer for 'all' teams to spend billions, just so players and agents etc get rich, or is the answer to bring the rich teams back down, and limit the spending of every team, meanwhile bringing the running costs of the game back down to earth? The problem isn't that Kenwright is skint. The problem is that football has been turned into a joke, and now multimillionaires can't afford to run their clubs, yet the expectancy of fans remains, despite knowing that the game is in a proper mess. Fans need to get a grip, and the governing bodies need to sanction a lot more than they are doing.

Good points. Any BU representative I've seen looks a little undereducated and over opinionated. I appreciate that football fans aren't always suited businessmen with their accountant on one side, and their solicitor on the other, and I appreciate that they're unlikely to all speak English like the queen, but the snob in me sees a scally having a moan, more than it sees an intellectual guardian angel, without wanting to be prejudiced. Do they really need to use an 18 stone skin head with a thick Scouse accent holding up a felt tip scribbled newspaper article to represent or portray them?

Are you not a believer in the words 'for better or for worse' or 'through thick and thin' Bluesky? Unfortunately too many Evertonians seem to be running home to mummy instead of waiting for the good times to return.

You can get a free health check at your doctors in the UK, which incorporates blood tests, pressure, diabetes check, cholesterol, lungs etc etc. Anybody around the age of 40 should definitely get one done. Learning to switch off from your job is key to avoiding stress and depression too.

I have a pdf that is 2.1 mb so can't upload it, but it is very useful for anybody wanting to understand how to keep healthy, and build muscle etc, and includes diets and explanations too. If you change the upload size restriction, I'll add it for those who want it.

The best thing about that table, if it's the same one, is the number of teams who no longer exist, which should serve as a reminder to all fans that things aren't quite so bad.

Good to see how many folk have stopped smoking.

Doesn't exactly come across as though he has all the answers, does he? Why do our fans keep calling us the 4th most successful club as though we're this huge dominating force? We are the 4th team in terms of league titles, but we're 7th in terms of trophies won. 15 trophies in 132 years isn't exactly a regular celebration either.

Every forum should have a 'health' thread. It's something 'everybody' has a stake in, one way or another, but how many of us are looking after ourselves, be it general fitness, diet & nutrition, exercise, medical issues, and so on? How often are you sat in front of a pc, or in front of the tv? How often is a Kebab and a 6 pack the order of the day? Are you smoking 60 per day? Are you getting any exercise, or do you understand what the calorie contents on food packets mean, and what to look for etc? The above aren't questions you need to answer etc, but just a few discussion points that crop up, but you'll be surprised how easy it is to 'let yourself go' so to speak, especially once you get over a certain age. I definitely sit at the pc too much, though I do work out a little on and off, yet nowhere near as much as I should. I'm reasonably fit and strong I guess, and probably slightly more than the 'average' guy my age, though my back has seen better days. I don't smoke after packing in for 18 months now, and don't drink too much, even if I do like the odd pint now and then. At the moment, I'm watching what I eat, and hoping to lose a little excess fat from the old belly and back in time for my hols in a few weeks, so I can take the old top off now and then without looking like I've had one too many burgers lol. What about you? Are you looking after your health, or are you a total slob in need of a firing squad?

That avatar will take a bit of getting used to BS. A little 'intimidating' to say the least.